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Post by kj on Jul 5, 2004 9:31:46 GMT -5
Is this board to discuss UK basketball, SK? Do we not discuss Carrier and Stockton and their lack of talent endlessly? Saul was a UK player. His talent or lack of talent is a point of discussion as is any player being mentioned with UK, ie Brian. Are they sacred cows in that they cannot be discussed like any number of UK players? I would think not. Donna has been noted by more than one person as being at practices and team functions consistently. More than one has also said she has butted where she has no business in the basketball program. Again is this the UK bball program we are discussing? I would think so. Anybody who is taking part in team functions imo is a valid point of discussion. Again no one has called any of the Smith family shiftless no good SOB's so your point has no merit. As far as calling anyone a moron, you misinterpreted my intent in that statement. From the tone of your, KTB's and Catmandoo's posts it seemed to me that anybody who cannot see the apparent greatness of Tubby is not too bright. Hence if anybody was called a moron, it was me because I sure don't see the greatness. So as far as being civil, I agree. Maybe sometimes my intent is not clear, if you have any questions you know where I am.
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Post by kentubbybasketball on Jul 5, 2004 12:13:39 GMT -5
Seattlekat, I am going on Tubby's past performances as a coach in the big games. I have never seen a team of Tubby's players come back like the 98 team did against Duke. I believe they were about 18 down when they made the famous run. That is a flat-out lie. Did you not watch the comeback from behind win against Stanford in the final four of that same year. What about the comeback from behind win against Utah in the title game that same year. Let's not forget our comeback from behind win against Florida at the O-Dome this year, down by 11 with about 7 minutes left, I believe. A Florida fan that was at the game said that comeback win by Kentucky was all orchestrated by Tubby from the bench. Were you at the game? There are many more games that I can list, but I don't need to. If you're gonna talk down Tubby use the facts instead of selective memory.
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Post by kentubbybasketball on Jul 5, 2004 12:16:37 GMT -5
As far as calling anyone a moron, you misinterpreted my intent in that statement. From the tone of your, KTB's and Catmandoo's posts it seemed to me that anybody who cannot see the apparent greatness of Tubby is not too bright. Hence if anybody was called a moron, it was me because I sure don't see the greatness. I am not asking anybody to say that Tubby is great. Tubby could careless what fans on a message board think about him, so why would I? I get a little angry when people are so quick to list the negatives, but are silent and quiet when something good happens. But, that's alright because the positives outweigh the negatives.
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Post by UKFAN on Jul 5, 2004 12:53:08 GMT -5
First of all kentubbybasketball, I am not a liar. You seem to be somewhat immature for calling someone as such without even knowing them. That just shows what type of Tubby fan you really are. Have you ever seen a group of Tubby players, and I wouldn't call the 98 team Tubby players except for Saul, come back in a game like the 98 team did. It was the style of play that they had been taught that got them back in it. It was the guts that they had and had learned from Pitino that got them back in it. Look back at some games Pitino coached and at some of the games Tubby coached. Never have you seen any of Tubby's players (I'm talking about the ones he recruited and trained) play like the 98 boys played. So kentubbybasketball, grow up and quit calling people liars when you have no clue what you are talking about.
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Post by BlueCat on Jul 5, 2004 13:19:41 GMT -5
It was the style of play that they had been taught that got them back in it. It was the guts that they had and had learned from Pitino that got them back in it. It was the halftime adjustments that Tubby made in those games that made the difference. The 96 - 97 teams didn't have to come from behind much because the talent level was much better than that of the 98 squad.
The 98 team won that championship because of two things IMO. 1. Rick Pitino had instilled in them a never say die attitude. 2. Tubby Smith did a GREAT job of coaching a team that had no where near the talent that the 96 squad had. He took a good team, and through the adjustments he and his staff made at halftime brought home number 7.
The talent level at UK has not been the same since, and so there are no more banners to be hung at this time. The talent is on the way, and we'll see just what Tubby can do with them.
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Post by kentubbybasketball on Jul 5, 2004 14:08:01 GMT -5
First of all kentubbybasketball, I am not a liar. You seem to be somewhat immature for calling someone as such without even knowing them. That just shows what type of Tubby fan you really are. Have you ever seen a group of Tubby players, and I wouldn't call the 98 team Tubby players except for Saul, come back in a game like the 98 team did. It was the style of play that they had been taught that got them back in it. It was the guts that they had and had learned from Pitino that got them back in it. Look back at some games Pitino coached and at some of the games Tubby coached. Never have you seen any of Tubby's players (I'm talking about the ones he recruited and trained) play like the 98 boys played. So kentubbybasketball, grow up and quit calling people liars when you have no clue what you are talking about. Here's a few comeback wins from Tubby's years at UK: @ Florida 2003-04 @ Vandy 2002-03 (the game that turned around the season) And countless others, but I'm not gonna waste my time on this. Go look at some records and how Tubby's teams have fared when they've been down at halftime. And, your comments about Tubby's players not ever coming back are false. It's something's false, it's a lie. I didn't tell you that, your mother should have. Or, in order to make you feel better, Dr. kentubbybasketball will diagnose this as SMS(selective memory syndrome). But, UKFAN, I said your post was a lie not you. I attacked the post not the poster.
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Post by UKFAN on Jul 5, 2004 16:51:10 GMT -5
kentubbybasketball, I never said that Tubby's teams haven't come back from being behind. I did say that none of them have come back like the 98 team did in the Duke game. Seems like you have selective reading. I don't think coming back from 11 points back with 7 minutes left nor coming back from 12 down at halftime is that much of an accomplishment. You must remember, Florida and Vandy are from the SEC. Whole lot different than playing Duke. In the 98 Duke game UK was behind 71-54 with 9:37 left to play. On the next 5 trips on their offensive end, they hit a 3pt, 3pt, 3pt play, 3pt, and 2ft from intentional foul and a 2pt field goal. In a matter of 3 minutes and 41 seconds they outscored Duke 17-1. And all of this against Duke; not Florida or Vandy. I do think Tubby made some smart moves down the stretch of the game by not calling timeout. Duke foolishly use their up trying to save possession of the ball. The only thing I could be critical of Tubby during the game was during the last 4.5 seconds, allowing Duke to try and set up a last shot. They failed, so that turned out to be a no issue anyway.
kentubbybasket, you wrote, "And, your comments about Tubby's players not ever coming back are false. It's something's false, it's a lie. I didn't tell you that, your mother should have. Or, in order to make you feel better, Dr. kentubbybasketball will diagnose this as SMS(selective memory syndrome)." I think it would be appropiate for you to leave my mother out of this. I take great exception to that comment. It only reiterates my statement about your inmaturity. Also, maybe Dr. kentubbybasketball should look in the mirror and diagnose yourself with TLS (Tubby loving syndrome) because in your eyes Tubby is perfect and can do no wrong. That just isn't the case.
BlueCat, without Anderson I think the 97 squad was more inexperienced and less talented than the 98 squad. With Anderson, the 97 squad is much better to say the least. Also, in the 98 Duke game, I didn't see Tubby make many halftime adjustments. The Cats were outscored 22-15 until the Cats started playing the game like Pitino had taught them, tough full court defense, excellent 3 point shooting and a strong desire to win. Didn't see where Tubby made any halftime adjustments. The 98 team had loads of maturity and was was very strong mentally.
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Post by BlueCat on Jul 5, 2004 17:20:54 GMT -5
BlueCat, without Anderson I think the 97 squad was more inexperienced and less talented than the 98 squad. With Anderson, the 97 squad is much better to say the least. Also, in the 98 Duke game, I didn't see Tubby make many halftime adjustments. The Cats were outscored 22-15 until the Cats started playing the game like Pitino had taught them, tough full court defense, excellent 3 point shooting and a strong desire to win. Didn't see where Tubby made any halftime adjustments. The 98 team had loads of maturity and was was very strong mentally. You are absolutely correct about the experience, but I would disagree with the talent level. Lost from the 97 squad was Derek Anderson, and Ron Mercer along with Epps, and Pricket.
You may not have seen the half time adjustments made by Tubby in the Duke game, and it may very well be that he didn't make them at half time. I doubt seriously however that the players just decided on their own to change their style, and make the comeback. Tubby made those adjustments.
I realize that it's your opinion and I respect that. I just feel that the 97 squad was more talented than the 98 squad. That of course is debatable.
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Post by UKFAN on Jul 5, 2004 17:38:14 GMT -5
BlueCat, Anderson played in the first 18 games. Without him, I think the 98 squad would of matchup better than the 97 squad. I think Mercer and Naz were better than anyone that filled their positions, but the rest of the 98 squad was better than the 97 squad. You have your ideas and I have mine. IMO, a good subject to discuss in a friendly manner. I think one of the smartest things Tubby did in the 98 Duke game was not to try and overcoach the game. That is why I don't think he made that many adjustments during the game. The turning point was when the boys got hot from the outside and capitalized on Duke's mistakes, both coaching and player. Regardless, the boys did a great job of coming back and Tubby did a great job of not trying to overcoach. A good basketball team will take what the defense gives them and those boys took advantage of that aspect of the game to its fullest, hitting the outside shot and Turner penetrating.
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Post by kj on Jul 5, 2004 18:54:51 GMT -5
I am not asking anybody to say that Tubby is great. Tubby could careless what fans on a message board think about him, so why would I? I get a little angry when people are so quick to list the negatives, but are silent and quiet when something good happens. But, that's alright because the positives outweigh the negatives. Again you seem to have a direct pipeline to Tubby, KTB . In reality you are making a guess unless you are Miss Cleo. ...... As you say these assertions made about Tubby that have no basis in reality other than your opinion are getting ANNOYING. I will give you blind loyalty to the man.
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Post by Seattlekat on Jul 5, 2004 20:22:23 GMT -5
Just as a few have blind loyalty to Pitino - and - he is an ex-Coach - who happens to coach at L-ville!! I have always given RP his due while at UK - but - in NO way is the "Golden Boy" of college basketball - as he once was when "roaming the sidelines" for the Wildcats!!! That is what he WAS - and - THAT is past tense. Every poster on this board has "wished" the Cats would have gone further in the Big Dance!! But - as stated many times by a few - "totally blame the Smiths." Yep - it is done on purpose just to make a few UK fans life miserable!!!! I am pro UK!!! I am pro the Coach of UK!! I am not - as some - in the "give up" on UK stage!! 55-9 is very outstanding!!! 2nd Rd is not!!! All will agree - I would think - on that!!!!! Take off the "RP blinders" - he is NOT - at UK!!!!!
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Post by kentubbybasketball on Jul 5, 2004 21:41:13 GMT -5
Again you seem to have a direct pipeline to Tubby, KTB . In reality you are making a guess unless you are Miss Cleo. ...... As you say these assertions made about Tubby that have no basis in reality other than your opinion are getting ANNOYING. I will give you blind loyalty to the man. Do you really think Tubby cares what you or I think about him? My comments weren't just my opinion--they are the truth. If Tubby cared about what you and I thought about him, you and your unflattering comments would have ran him off a long time ago. TLS? UKFAN, I don't think it's love for Tubby. I call it respecting a guy that has proven he's a great coach. I'm just supporting the guy that occupies the top seat on our bench.
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Post by kentubbybasketball on Jul 5, 2004 21:53:17 GMT -5
I'd like to issue an apology to UKFAN for my comments. I will be the first to admit that my comments regarding your mother were very immature, and I am sincerely sorry for those comments and the displeasure that I have caused you recently.
I think what it all boils down to is that everybody on these message boards are a little bit stubborn. Everyone thinks that his or her opinion is always correct, and they get offended when others disagree. We're both guilty of that.
I didn't really mean anything personal from my comments, but looking back on it, I realize that they were personal. I'm really not a bad person, I just made bad judgement. If I had the opportunity to redo it, I wouldn't have made those comments. It's very embarrasing. I respect your opinion(even tho we often disagree), but I'm glad you're posting here. For now on, if I have something to disagree with you about, I'll handle myself in a more mature way.
Please don't allow stupid comments from an immature 18-year kid make you have a bad day. That's the least thing I would want to do.
I feel like I owe the board this apology.
Leo--ktb
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Post by kentruppybasketball on Jul 5, 2004 22:36:09 GMT -5
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Post by kj on Jul 5, 2004 23:09:46 GMT -5
Do you really think Tubby cares what you or I think about him? My comments weren't just my opinion--they are the truth. If Tubby cared about what you and I thought about him, you and your unflattering comments would have ran him off a long time ago. TLS? UKFAN, I don't think it's love for Tubby. I call it respecting a guy that has proven he's a great coach. I'm just supporting the guy that occupies the top seat on our bench. Have you in fact asked Tubby personally this question, KTB? Has he personally replied? I think not; therefore, it is conjecture on your part, nothing more. Sometimes you amaze me.
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